Pick a Course and Go With It
August 27, 2010 at 11:06 am | Posted in Manny Ramirez | 25 Comments
Quick update: SI’s Jon Heyman reports that the waiver period on Manny Ramirez expires today at 1:30pm EST, or about 2.5 hours from now. That doesn’t mean that we’ll know for sure if he’s on another team by then, it just means that we’ll know whether he’s been claimed by another team or if he’s made it through, allowing the Dodgers to explore trades with any club.
Now, with the Dodgers having swept the Brewers and climbing to within five games of the wild card, there’s calls from some corners that say the Dodgers are still close enough to contending that they shouldn’t be selling. You know that I don’t really agree with that – there’s still four teams ahead of the Dodgers, and sweeping the 59-68 Brewers isn’t exactly a monumental achievement – but I understand how the case can be made.
So here’s all I ask of the team: whichever path you choose, don’t half-ass it. If you think you really have a shot, then don’t trade Manny. There’s no question that his presence fundamentally changes the lineup, and you can’t really be saying you’re trying to win if you’re playing Scott Podsednik (one of the three worst .300 hitters this year, according to baseball-reference) in left field instead of Manny, because that’s a huge dropoff in production. There’s no way you can let Manny go, and act as though you’re still a contender.
But that goes the other way as well. If you decide that it’s time to pack it up, and to move Manny, it shouldn’t stop there. Ted Lilly should go. Hiroki Kuroda. Octavio Dotel. Casey Blake, if you can get anyone to pick up his contract for next year. Really, anyone who’s not signed for 2011 or doesn’t have a good chance of returning should be moved. I’m probably not speaking for the majority here, but if the team doesn’t make the playoffs then it makes no difference at all to me whether they finish 4 games out or 10.
We’ll know a lot more in just over two hours. Here’s what I would do, though: I expect that Manny does make it through waivers, despite claims that the White Sox would grab him. If that’s the case, then you do nothing for the next three days, as you see how the series in Colorado shakes out. The Rockies are ahead of the Dodgers in the standings, and they’ve been red-hot lately. If you can win 2 of 3, hope that somehow the Giants drop a few to the Diamondbacks, and you end up within 3 games by the end of the weekend, then fine: make a run. If, as I suspect, the streaking Rockies win the series and the last-place Dbacks give the Giants little trouble, then you spend all of Monday and Tuesday burning up the phones to get whatever you can for whatever people want.
Whichever way things turn out, it has to be all or nothing. You can’t trade Manny and then keep Kuroda and/or Lilly. You just can’t.
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Comment by Rob McMillin— August 27, 2010 #
I agree, but don’t really care about waiving good players if it’s just for salary relief. I have no faith in the way the McCourt regime would utilize that revenue…probably another beachside haven.
Comment by SamAdams— August 27, 2010 #
Totally agree MTSI…we control our destiny this weekend and if we are not in the race on Sunday, pack it up. I don’t care if we are 4 or 10 back either, as long as we spoil it for SF and win the season series against him…that is a minimum requirement every year!
Comment by Jeff— August 27, 2010 #
One question i have on sending lilly or Kuroda. Do you think we would have a better chance resigning them if we kept them or do you think we would have about the same chance as sending them off? Mainly i ask about Kuroda, because I wouldn’t mind seeing him here nest year. I feel he is pretty undervalued for how good he is. And unless the team changes strategies and gets Lee he may be the best pitcher we could get.
Comment by Gillbert— August 27, 2010 #
Kuroda’s going to be a very interesting case. There’s been rumors that he might go home to Japan to play, or retire. So you have to get past that hurdle first.
Also, people seem to forget this because he’s so old, but he is NOT a free agent after the season. He has 3 years of service time, so he’ll be arbitration eligible just like any other player with that service time.
Comment by Mike Scioscia's tragic illness— August 27, 2010 #
According to Cot’s, he will be a free agent after this season.
Comment by willie— August 27, 2010 #
looks like you’re right. I guess I was mistaken there.
Comment by Mike Scioscia's tragic illness— August 27, 2010 #
MSTI-great post. I agree they need to decide which way there gonna go. if were keeping manny then lets make a run at the WC, otherwise bring on the Tim Wallach era!
you forgot to mention Kemp’s TOOTBLAN in yesterdays game!
Comment by format— August 27, 2010 #
I didn’t see Kemp yesterday as a TOOTBLAN. Loved the aggressiveness.
Reply fail.
Comment by Gary— August 27, 2010 #
Lilly has been lights out brilliant for 5 straight games. I’d try to re-sign him regardless of what happens this year.
Comment by Ray— August 27, 2010 #
I say keep everyone for the weekend and then trade em or unload em for salary relief. Manny, Lilly, Blake, Posednik, & Kuroda. Even if we sweep the rox I say still unload – I mean thats a lot of cash, we could get back – In Lilly’s case contenders should be lining up to get him he’s been lights out. (I definitely look at siging him in the off season.) It’s really a long shot for us to get back into this and even if we did we’d get crushed in the playoffs so why not gear up for next year?
Perhaps with all the $ saved we could fill our left field void with Carl Crawford next year?! HA! sorry guys thought we were a big market team with a huge fan base that wants a championship for a second.
Comment by Patrick— August 27, 2010 #
Deal ‘em.
Comment by dutchbubba— August 27, 2010 #
Not that I don’t want the team doing well, but the 5 game back limbo is the toughest place for me to be as a fan…not far enough out of it and not quite “in” it either…which will create a “what if” scenario for either scenario (keeping or dealing Manny). I hate ‘what if’s.
But I agree 100% with your take. If we’re going to deal, go all in. And if we’re going for it, then you HAVE to keep Manny…home runs or not his presence changes this lineup (raising a whole other ‘what if’, where would we be if we had ethier-ramirez-kemp for the entire season?)
I think the hardest place in sports for a fan is exactly where the team is now: right on the fence of contender/non contender.
Comment by Mike G— August 27, 2010 #
The Dodgers’ current dilemma is due, entirely, to the corrupting influence of the “wild card.” Too many mediocre teams, convinced they still have a chance, postpone retooling for the following season.
Comment by WBB— August 27, 2010 #
WBB, do you have a job?
Comment by jonnysanchez— August 27, 2010 #
WBB, in your scenario, wouldn’t the Dodgers be more emblematic of the cause of the problem as opposed to a victim?
Comment by jonnysanchez— August 27, 2010 #
Wow, check today’s lineup. Manny not playing again. **** Torre.
Claimed by the White Sox btw.
Comment by Jason— August 27, 2010 #
And the Rangers. Allegedly.
Comment by Vegas Blue— August 27, 2010 #
Would it make sense to keep Lilly and Kuroda, offer arbitration and then get draft picks if they don’t sign? Wouldn’t they get better players than trying to trade them at this point?
Comment by el don— August 27, 2010 #
Great post! I’ve been thinking that too – if we’re still acting like we’re contending, why are we waiving Manny, Lilly, Kuroda, etc? And if we’re not contending? Well, why are we using Kuo two innings in a row?
Comment by Jeff— August 27, 2010 #
idiot torre goes with the matchups again tonight
POD over manny=stupid
Comment by format— August 27, 2010 #
Great post as always. I pretty much always agree with you, which is why I read your blog everyday. HOWEVER, I’m really struggling with this one.
I know that the Dodgers shouldn’t expect anything good in return for Manny. BUT, given that Kenny Williams has given up Ely and Link plus cash for Pierre, as well as good pitching for Peavy, he might be dumb enough to give up something worthwhile (I know it’s highly unlikely). The Dodgers gaining ground only gives Colletti more leverage, because he’s not inclined to sell.
Given Manny’s injury history, is keeping Manny all that integral to our (fleeting) postseason hopes? The Dodgers likely can’t do it without Manny, but who knows if we’ll even have him? And why not go for it without him? Dodgers have a good history of signing midseason acquisitions, so why not stick with Lilly for now? Blake and Podsednick wouldn’t get a decent return anyway, so keep them.
If they can get a prospect (a huge IF, obviously), then would you agree with trading ONLY Manny?
Comment by Tom— August 28, 2010 #
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